Quote 2 particular lines or passages from within Chap 5-12: one that feels imp’t to the text and one that feels imp’t to you, and explain why they feel imp’t. End your post w/ a question. (Note page #s.)
Also, reply to at least one student's post.
“Reuven, as you grow older you will discover that the most important things that will happen to you will often come as a result of silly things as you call them – “ordinary things” is a better expression. That is the way of the world.” (p 110)
ReplyDeleteI think that this is extremely wise. Reuven’s father is very insightful, and I agree with quote. Sometimes the smallest things, the ordinary thing, the “silly things” can mean the most. I think that this is something everyone should take with them and remember that sometimes the most important things come from the smallest things. This can remind you that something amazing can happen for someone if you are kind, or you look at the homeless person on the sidewalk and give them a dollar. I think that if you take this quote out of context it can be applied to everyday life, for remembering the importance of the ordinary things. Ordinary can turn into extraordinary very easily. I wonder if this book with contain any more “ordinary things”?
“Reb Saunders looked at me, his eyes dark and brooding. ‘You think a friend is an easy thing to be? If you are truly his friend, you will discover otherwise.’” (p 142)
I think that is quote is important to the text. It shows the wiseness of Reb Saunders but also the big expectations he has of Reuven and Danny. It is also almost menacing. I think that it is also foretelling of what might happen in the story. The strength of Reuven’s friendship will be tested at some point in the book. My guess is that Danny will not want to become the rabbi after his father, and that Reuven will be involved in that somehow. Another thought I have about this quote is that it is also almost menacing, as if it will be Reb Saunders who will show Reuven that being a friend is difficult. How will Reb Saunders be involved in Danny and Reuven’s friendship?
Nilla, I agree with you particularly with the part when you say that you do not expect that Danny will become a rabbi. I feel like Reuven plays a pretty important role in the life of Danny, because Reuven lives more of a 'free' life, by not going to the extremes in order to practice religion so devoutly. I think that Danny, despite his intense studying of Talmud, does admire Reuven for this, and possibly this is why Reb Saunders was so selective when deciding whether or not it was okay for Danny and Reuven to become friends. Maybe he feared that if Danny acquired a friend, Danny would be led astray by that friend, possibly intentionally, for whatever odd reason Reb Saunders could come up with in his own head. Maybe he expected an apikoros to ignore his family's rabbinic dynasty, and make his son be led away from Hasidism.
DeleteComment: I agree with what you have to say about the first quote, that quote definitely struck me as very wise and interesting as well. I love when reading I can take a quote out of context (as you say) and use it in my own life. Sometimes the things that seem of the least importance in the moment are the ones that somehow stick with you forever. It’s like the idea, that one tiny change could affect the result of everything else. I love looking back and watching this almost pattern of things that were small in the moment, but for some time and possibly in some cases forever have affected the way I see my life. Even in this book it’s definitely a huge message or even theme. From the start of the book he says: “For the first fifteen years of our lives, Danny and I lived within five blocks of each other and neither of us knew of the other’s existence.” He comes back to this later when he mentions all the similarities between their live’s and houses, though at the same time they are from ‘two different worlds’. An original boundary between Hasidic and Orthodox was crossed and an unforgettable friendship forged from one small thing, years and years of life could/have been changed from one afternoon involving a baseball game.
Delete“And once, during a supper meal, I saw tears come slowly from his eyes and disappear into the tangle of the dark beard.” (p. 184)
ReplyDeleteI think that this quote is important to the text because it suddenly makes the story in the book much more real. Reuven is confused as to why Reb Saunders keeps crying over his plate at the dinner table, and so he asks Danny. Danny immediately tells Reuven that it is because of the six million jewish people that were massacred in concentration camps. Reuven questions whether there is another reason, but Danny insists that there is not, saying that he does not want to talk about it. For me, I suddenly realized how jewish people in America (who were relatively separated from all the violence associated with World War II) were also affected by this conflict. Even if this is not actually what Reb Saunders was crying about, I can say for sure that many jewish people in America would have acted in this manner. I wonder how they felt, and what they wished they could do to help, watching helplessly as their people were murdered across the ocean. Especially in Reb Saunders’ high religious position, he might have felt especially responsible for the preservation of his people and religion. I know I would have been in complete emotional distress. What would it have been like to be in Reb Saunders’ shoes during the Holocaust?
“Reb Saunders stared at me, his eyes suddenly wild with rage, his beard trembling. And he pointed a finger at me that looked like a weapon.” (p. 187)
This quote is really important to me because it really dives into Reb Saunders’ complex personality. He is a man of great power within his community. Everyone who ever has a problem comes to him, thinking of him as a bridge between themselves and God. However, since he has become accustomed to this great feeling of reverence that people have for him, he hates to be disrespected. He obviously has very strict religious beliefs, and I personally feel like anyone who strays from his beliefs is automatically considered an apikoros by him. Reuven had simply mentioned that many people (including his father) were saying that Palestine should become a Jewish homeland ‘and not only a place where pious Jews went to die’. I understand that this statement could have been controversial, but I think that it was extreme for Reb Saunders to blow up at Reuven, who is only a child. Danny and his entire family went rigid and got extremely uncomfortable when Reuven made that statement. Perhaps something like this had happened before. Could Reb Saunders’ unpredictable behavior be one of the reasons why Danny never talks to his father?
A moment that I thought was very important to the overall storyline of The Chosen was the section where Reb Saunders was testing Danny by having him correct his mistake in his speech and then he included Reuven (pages 132-134). Especially with the concluding line(s) “He looked at me, smiling broadly, his teeth showing white through the beard, and I almost thought I saw his eyes mist over. There was a loud murmur from the crowd, and Danny’s body sagged as the tension went out of him. He glance at me, his face a mixture of surprise and relief, and I realized with astonishment that I, too, had just passed some kind of test (p.134). ” This section is very important because it’s what brings Reuven into the community. After proving himself he is looked at differently than upon his arrival, when is was judged for being from a different sect/community of Judaism. After this he is accepted as an equal and almost as one of their people. This quote shows the arc of approval not only of Reb Saunders, but also of the community, and any second thoughts Danny was having as well. This quote is a turning point for the story from being two separate peoples, to people who practice and discuss religion, Torah, and the Talmud together.
ReplyDeleteA quote that I personally found important was: “God is everywhere, he told them, and if it seems at times that He is hidden from us, it is only because we have not yet learned to seek Him correctly (p. 103).” This quote spoke to me personally. When I was thirteen I was Bat Mitzvahed, around the time of this my belief in G-d was being questioned. It’s not something I usually think about but this event brought up not only my own wondering but that of others around me, both family and mentors (my tutor and rabbi). When I was asked how I felt, I was never really sure, some part of believed, and some part of me didn’t, and all of me didn’t think of a man sitting on clouds in the sky but more of a feeling everywhere. My faith was and still is so flimsy that sometimes I wouldn’t be able to hear other’s arguments against G-d because my opinion could be so easily swayed. The kind of arguments such as “...I prayed to G-d and nothing happened...” or “...If G-d loves everyone why did ___ happen?...” This quote not only reassures the reasoning of why he sometimes seems absent, but also is just a hopeful reminder that G-d doesn’t have to be a yes or no, or there or not, but somewhere in between.
In this section of the book I started to wonder about Reuven’s mom’s role in his life. What happened to Reuven’s her? What was she like? How has her not being there changed how is life has gone? Also on the bottom of page 107 when his Dad starts to say something about her, WHAT WAS HE GOING TO SAY?!?
I also thought that the section you chose was important to the story. I really enjoyed the scene for the same reason that you did. The acceptance that they had for him was really moving. When we first started this book I thought that Danny and his religious group were not really accepting people, especially when it came to Reuven. This section clearly changed what I thought and I think it definitely changed Reuven’s thought as well.
DeleteI also chose this section because it is definitely an important part of the story where we can see two different people who practice differently come together and accept each other. Like the last section of the book we read my view on a lot of people changed in this part. I also like the quote you chose because it means people can find god in their own way. Also awesome questions!
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Delete“‘It occurred to me recently that if I didn’t take my father’s place I wouldn’t be breaking the dynasty after all. My brother could take over. I had talked myself into believing that if I didn’t take his place I would break the dynasty. I think I had to justify to myself having to become a tzaddik.’” (p. 201)
ReplyDeleteI think that this quote is important to the story because it is the first time that Danny realises that he doesn’t have to take his fathers place. Before this moment he felt trapped in this situation and had no real way out. If he decided to do anything other than take his fathers place, then the dynasty would have ended. Before Danny thought that he was the only one able to continue the dynasty because of his brothers illness. But after this he realises that his brother’s illness isn’t actually preventing him. Because of this, Danny decides that he isn’t going to take his fathers place and instead is going to do what he wants. I think that his father is going to be really upset with him, but more upset with Reuven. I think that he is going to blame Reuven for encouraging him to do this.
“‘Reb Saunders is a very complicated man, abba. I can’t make him out. One minute he’s hard and angry, the next minute he’s soft and gentle. I don’t understand him.’” (p. 147)
This quote is important to me because I too have been very confused on how I feel about Reb Saunders. For the past few chapters we’ve seen two different sides of him. We’ve seen the side of him that cares about his family and is worried about what his son is reading, the proud father, the caring rabbi who is distressed about the war and the deaths it has caused, and the angry man who yelled at Reuven. Like Reuven said, I think that Reb Saunders is a very complicated man. I especially can’t understand how he can care so much for Danny but can’t even talk to him.
How can Reb Saunders have so many different sides to his personality? Which side of his personality will we see when Danny tells him about his decision?
I was also really struck by the second quote, because Reuven is just trying to be friends with Danny, but he has so much to overcome, like Reb Saunders. Sometimes, he thinks Danny's father is very nice, sympathetic, and caring, but then he has to question why he won't even talk to his own son. I also question this, but I especially wonder about Reb Saunder's integrity. It is clear that he cares for his son more than anyone else. He even says that his son is his most "precious possession" (p 166). But what is he willing to do to get his son where he wants him to be? Can he really care so much for his son, yet not be able to talk to him, and not be able to let Danny be what he wants to be?
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ReplyDelete"' I hope you don't mind my saying this, but your father sounds like a tyrant.'
ReplyDeleteDanny didn't disagree. 'He's a very strong-willed person. When he makes up his mind about something, that's it, finished.'" (p 116).
This passage was very surprising to me, but it also seemed pertinent to the story. Not only is Reb Saunders Danny's father, but he is also Danny's religious leader, so it is almost astounding that he would not defend his father against such accusations. The especially surprising part is that Reuven is specifically speaking about Reb Saunders as a father, and still Danny does not disagree. The relationship between Danny and his father is very interesting, and seems to grow throughout the book, and I would like to see what ends up happening between them, because sometimes they seem very close, and other times their distance seems unfixable.
"With no congregants around, and with me an accepted member of the family, Danny and his father fought through their points with loud voices and wild gestures of their hands almost to where I thought they might come to blows" (p 163).
This is not very important to the story, but I find it remarkable that Reuven thinks he is accepted into their family after just one visit, and one time correcting Reb Saunders' passage. I can't really tell if Reuven is just naive, and they really haven't accepted him, or if the Saunders are just very welcoming people, who are willing to take people in after very little time knowing them. One question I might ask is: Was the real reason why Reb Saunders was so nice to Reuven at first because he wanted him to act as a "buffer", as Reuven's father called it (p 170)? Does he just need Reuven to serve as a go-between for him and Danny?
I agree I almost picked that first quote because I thought Danny would defend his father too. It seems like Danny looks up to his father, so you would think he would defend him, but I also get why he didn't. Red Saunders doesn't seem like a very nurturing father. Danny's live seems to be pretty planed out and his father even wants control over who Danny's friends are. I would resent my father if I had one like Reb Saunders. I think a part of Danny does resent his father, but since he is also Danny's religious leader he has to look up to him. I also think Danny is envious of Reuven's relationship with his father.
Delete"I looked at Reb Saunders. 'No,' I heard myself say hoarsely. 'They were not all good.' There was a stir from the men at the tables. Reb Saunders sat back in his leather chair. 'Nu, Reuven,' he said quietly, 'tell me, which one was not good?" (pg 139) Reb is testing Reuven in front of the entire congregation to see what kind of friend he will be to Danny. I think this is an important part of the story because Reb accepting Reuven into the community is a big deal especially because he disagrees with the writings of Reuvens father. This part of the book also shows a level of commitment because Reuven was uncomfortable but he still chose to stay for the whole thing. How would Reuven and Danny's friendship be affected if Reb Saunders hadn't approved of it?
ReplyDelete"'We're so complicated inside,' [Danny] went on quietly. 'There's something in us called the unconscious that we're completely unaware of. It practically dominates our lives, and we don't even know it'"(pg 155). Here Danny is talking about phycology and how our subconscious lets out a lot of emotions and fears through our dreams. I really this especially the first part 'we're so complicated inside'. It's not very important but it did make me think of the characters and what I know about them so far. The way Danny said it also made me think that there is something troubling him that we still haven't learned about. Why does Reb Saunders seem so emotional about things? Was there something important in the last few pages where we learned that Danny needs and then gets glasses?
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DeleteI agree with you on your second quote. Danny is interested in phsycology, and I wonder if we will see more of him talking about it. Also, I wonder if he is talking about his father when he says "We're so complicated inside". Is he trying to help Reuven believe that his father is not a tyrant, and maybe he has a reason for being the way he is?
Delete"He wants to meet you. I told him we were friends." (111)
ReplyDeleteThis quote and passage stood out as important to me. Danny and Reuven have become friends. They are from two different worlds. His father wants to meet Reuven because he is an apikoros. Reuven also wonders a lot about what his friends will think once they find out about Danny and him becoming friends. He wonders if they will be mad because Danny is a hasidic. Danny also seems worried about what his friends will think. Their worlds are so separate and different I'm interested to find out what happens now that they are friends. I wonder if it will bring their worlds closer together.
“God is everywhere, he told them, and if it seems at times that He is hidden from us, it is only because we have not yet learned to seek Him correctly." (103)
This quote about God also spoke to me. When I was younger I asked my sister if she believed in God. She said yes and that God was all around us and he was inside everyone's hearts. I don't really remember the rest of what she said, but that was the gist of it. She was saying that God was more of a feeling that lived in all of us if we chose to feel it. That quote reminded me of her telling me that.
Do you think Danny and Reuven becoming friends will bring their worlds closer together?
"Reb Saunders looked at me, his eyes dark and brooding. ‘You think a friend is an easy thing to be? If you are truly his friend, you will discover otherwise’” (p 142).
ReplyDeleteThis passage was important to me because there have been times when being friends with people is the hardest thing I have ever done. I don't mean this as in I didn't like them and had to pretend, but friendship takes a lot of work, and it can hurt a lot. It is not hard to be kindof friends with people, but being someones best friend, depending on the person, can be very hard. I would never stop being friends with someone because it is hard. I think it means that they need the friendship more.
"' I hope you don't mind my saying this, but your father sounds like a tyrant.'
Danny didn't disagree. 'He's a very strong-willed person. When he makes up his mind about something, that's it, finished'" (p 116).
I think this quote is important to the text. Reb Saunders is a very complex person, but also I feel like this quote describes him very well. He is a man who has a very strong will, and this has led to some people disliking him. But I think that he has developed to be this way because that was the only way to survive during the hard times before. His more "human" emotions are still there, but I think he feels that he needs to hide them to stay a strong leader.
I wonder what else will happen between Reuven and Danny and Reb Saunders. Will we get to know Reb Saunders better? And will that make us like him more or less?
One quote that felt important to me was, "I admire him. I don't know what he's trying to do to me with this weird silence that he's established between us, but I admire him." (pg 191) I really like and chose this quote because although Reuven doesn't always agree with his father and may not always show his love towards him, he does indeed love and admire his father. I'm the same way with both of my parents.
ReplyDeleteA quote that I felt was important to the text was, "He put down the glass, sighed, and said, 'Reuven, it is a tragedy your mother is not alive to—' He stopped, his voice breaking" (111). I think that we've gone through most of the book without knowing much about Reuven's family. Now this simple line tells us a lot more about his family history, which makes me wonder if we'll learn some more about his family history in the last couple chapters.
I believe I had a question similar to this a couple weeks ago, but do you think that the war will play a bigger role in the book, despite that there's only a few chapters left?